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Date: 2010-05-17 (15:14)
From: Rabih CHAAR <rabih.chaar@l...>
Subject: Re: [Caml-list] Phantom types [NC]
if you define the intermediate type
type s= {l:float}
followed by
type 'a t = s
everything goes well

I am unable to give you an explanation about this (the need of the 
intermediay type s). I hope someone can shed some light on this.


Thomas Braibant <> 
Sent by:
17/05/10 04:59 PM


[Caml-list] Phantom types

Hi list,

Following on the thread "Subtyping structurally-equivalent records, or
something like it?", I made some experimentations with phantom types.
Unfortunately, I turns out that I do not understand the results I got.

Could someone on the list explain why the first piece of code is well
typed, while the second one is not ?

type p1
type p2

type 'a t = float
let x : p1 t = 0.0
let id : p2 t -> p2 t = fun x -> x
let _ = id x (* type checks with type p2 t*)

type 'a t = {l: float}
let x : p1 t = {l = 0.0}
let id : p2 t -> p2 t = fun x -> x
let _ = id x (* ill typed *)

Any thoughts ?


2010/5/1 Stéphane Lescuyer <>:
> Hi Anthony,
> I think that maybe using phantom types could do the trick : consider
> defining empty types for all the different "kinds" of similar
> constructs that you have, and then define the kinematic record with a
> phantom parameter type.
> type position
> type acceleration
> type force
> type 'a kinematic = {lin : Vec.t; ang: Vec.t}
> By adding some extra typing annotations, you can then constraint your
> functions to accept (or produce) only a given kind of construct, say
> for example a position kinematic :
> let pos_0 : position kinematic = {lin = Vec.origin; ang = Vec.origin }
> let double_force (v : force kinematic) : force kinematic = {lin =
> Vec.mult 2. v.lin; ang = v.ang }
> double_force pos_0 -> does not type check
> You can write generic functions as add, norm, products, etc : they are
> just polymorphic with respect to the phantom type parameter. By the
> way you ensure that you are not multiplying apples and carrots :
> let plus (v : 'a kinematic) (v' : 'a kinematic) : 'a kinematic = ...
> Of course, the overhead is that you have to explicitely write some
> type annotations, especially for constructors, but the runtime
> overhead is exactly 0. And also, one limitation is that you can't use
> different projection names for the different cosntructs, since it is
> really always the same record type that you are using.
> I hope this helps,
> Stéphane L.
> On Sat, May 1, 2010 at 6:04 PM, Anthony Tavener
> <> wrote:
>> I have this:
>>   type kinematic = { lin: Vec.t; ang: Vec.t }
>> Which I've been using to represent a medley of physical attributes 
>> momentum, velocity, etc.).
>> As the physics code becomes increasingly substantial I'm running into
>> possible human-error, like passing a momentum where a force is 
expected, or
>> a mass instead of inverse-mass (mass is also a record though different, 
>> inv-mass has the same structure as mass). So I'd like to make distinct
>> types, such as:
>>   type position = { r: Vec.t; theta: Vec.t }
>>   type acceleration = { a: Vec.t; alpha: Vec.t }
>>   type force = { f: Vec.t; tau: Vec.t }
>> They are structurally equivalent, and ideally I'd like to be able to 
>> these as 'kinematic' too, since that is how I would express the 
>> and common functions on these types (add, mul, etc).
>> I'm sure I've seen posts on this before but I can't find them now 
>> what I remember are questions about having distinct 'float' types, such 
>> for degrees vs radians, rather than records).
>> I know OCaml doesn't have subtypes for records, which is effectively 
>> I'm looking for. Though this case is a bit more specialized that 
that... all
>> the subtypes and base type are structurally equivalent. Code for one of
>> these types would technically work on any... but is there a way to 
>> the type system of my intentions?
>> I hope someone has a better option than those I've considered, or that 
>> have a grave misunderstanding somewhere and one of these options is 
>> good:
>> 1. Objects. Subtyping makes these a natural fit, but in this case I 
>> need anything else which objects provide, and a certainly don't need 
>> poor performance or method-calling mixed in with my computational code
>> (aesthetically... yucky, to me). Again, each type is structurally
>> equivalent. Just some functions want certain types.
>> 2. Using distinct records for each type, but no 'kinematic' base type, 
>> all common operations are duplicated for each new type. No performance 
>> But the redundant code is horrible -- makes extensions a pain, and a
>> potential bug-source.
>> 2b. Same as above, but putting the common code in a functor which we 
>> on all the different types. I think this will add some overhead, since 
>> signature of the types (below) would demand accessor functions for the
>> record fields, in order to uniformly get the fields from the different 
>> (again, even though they are structurally equivalent) -- these calls
>> probably wouldn't get optimized out. But maybe there is a better way to 
>> this?
>>   module type KINEMATIC = sig
>>     type t
>>     val lin : t -> Vec.t
>>     val ang : t -> Vec.t
>>   end
>> 3. Making all the other types different aliases of 'kinematic'; then 
>> explicit type declarations in function parameters and coercion to
>> 'kinematic' when needed. This makes some ugly code, and the 
>> is almost illusory. This is kind-of like 'typesafe' C code doing 
>> gymnastics.
>> 4. Adapter functions: 'kinematic_of_force: force -> kinematic', etc. as 
>> way to use the common set of 'kinematic' functions. This is clunky and 
>> with a big performance hit unless these functions became like
>> type-coercions. If there is a way this can be done with zero runtime 
>> I'd accept the clunkiness. :)
>> Any thoughts?
>> I've been using OCaml for a few years now, but this is my first post. I 
>> many of you are familiar online personae through reading archives, 
>> and websites. Thank-you for all the help I've absorbed through those 
>> channels. And thanks to those making the language I favor for most 
>> Briefly introducing myself: I've been a professional video-game 
>> for 15 years, most recently specializing in AI. I quit my last job 
>> two years ago to travel and program (95% in OCaml!), and am developing 
>> game now. I've seen indications over the years of other game developers
>> taking the plunge and then parting ways with OCaml, surely back to C++. 
>> see OCaml as viable and certainly more pleasurable, even with avoiding
>> mutation. But within a pressure-cooker environment (working for $$ from
>> someone else) people fall back on what they are most familiar with... 
>> you can't go too rogue while still being part of a team. :)
>> -Anthony Tavener
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